add a "auto number" culomn in the list.
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add a "auto number" culomn in the list.

 
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amos hchmon
Guest





Posted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:51 pm    Post subject: add a "auto number" culomn in the list. Reply with quote

I want to add an "auto number" column to my list in the team site.
Did its possible ? because do not exist attribute in the "add list".
If did, how do it.

thanks for who refer my question.
Back to top
Engelbert
Guest





Posted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:51 pm    Post subject: Re: add a "auto number" culomn in the list. Reply with quote

You can use the standard ID field. It's an autonumber.

Just select it in your specification of the View. It's listed already.

Engelbert

"amos hchmon" <amoshchmon@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:19AA19AB-D0CA-43DB-894E-D1832B022422@microsoft.com...
Quote:
I want to add an "auto number" column to my list in the team site.
Did its possible ? because do not exist attribute in the "add list".
If did, how do it.

thanks for who refer my question.
Back to top
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]
Guest





Posted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 9:51 pm    Post subject: Re: add a "auto number" culomn in the list. Reply with quote

Hello Engelbert,
Well, it's not strictly autonumber. Whenever a list item is added to a document
library, a stored procedure is called that queries one of the tables in the
database. This query returns the next available itemID value. That value
is then incremented, and returned back. So, while the itemID looks to be
autonumber; in actuality, it is not. The ramifications of this being that
if that underlying value is changed, either programatically or otherwise,
you could end up re-using an itemID. We've seen it happen before.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.

E> You can use the standard ID field. It's an autonumber.
E>
E> Just select it in your specification of the View. It's listed
E> already.
E>
E> Engelbert
E>
E> "amos hchmon" <amoshchmon@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
E> news:19AA19AB-D0CA-43DB-894E-D1832B022422@microsoft.com...
E>
Quote:
I want to add an "auto number" column to my list in the team site.
Did its possible ? because do not exist attribute in the "add list".
If did, how do it.

thanks for who refer my question.
Back to top
Engelbert
Guest





Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 9:51 am    Post subject: Re: add a "auto number" culomn in the list. Reply with quote

Well you know best, but I'm not sure I follow the logic.

Quote:
The ramifications of this being that if that underlying value is changed,
either programatically or otherwise, you could end up re-using an itemID.

a) what's the "underlying value"

this

Quote:
Whenever a list item is added to a document library, a stored procedure is
called that queries one of the tables in the database. This query returns
the next available itemID value. That value is then incremented, and
returned back.

Seems to indicate 1,2,3,4,5,6 etc. because the next available will always
surely be the next number in order. No ?

Or is it that if you delete a document then it's ID number becomes available
for re-use. This seems unlikely because then you'd need to retain *all*
previously deleted numbers and the largest ID number so far rather than
having a single field containing the next number.

b) "either programatically or otherwise"

are you saying that the code written by Microsoft and which is in WSS as
delivered could do this ("otherwise"), or are you saying that if some
user/administrator writes *their own* code ("programmatically"), they could
mess this up ?

Surely then it would be their fault if the ID field didn't work as it should
?

Engelbert

"Mike McIntyre [MSFT]" <mmcintyr@online.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:6c3b040867438c7b1b3dd6f6487@msnews.microsoft.com...
Quote:
Hello Engelbert,
Well, it's not strictly autonumber. Whenever a list item is added to a
document library, a stored procedure is called that queries one of the
tables in the database. This query returns the next available itemID
value. That value is then incremented, and returned back. So, while the
itemID looks to be autonumber; in actuality, it is not. The ramifications
of this being that if that underlying value is changed, either
programatically or otherwise, you could end up re-using an itemID. We've
seen it happen before.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.

E> You can use the standard ID field. It's an autonumber.
E> E> Just select it in your specification of the View. It's listed
E> already.
E> E> Engelbert
E> E> "amos hchmon" <amoshchmon@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message
E> news:19AA19AB-D0CA-43DB-894E-D1832B022422@microsoft.com...
E
I want to add an "auto number" column to my list in the team site.
Did its possible ? because do not exist attribute in the "add list".
If did, how do it.

thanks for who refer my question.


Back to top
Engelbert
Guest





Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 5:51 pm    Post subject: Re: add a "auto number" culomn in the list. Reply with quote

Thanks for spending the time to go through this.

Just the final nail in this.

Using your example, if the description field of #1 is edited *using the
normal WSS UI* then what you wrote applies ?

I.e. it's not only a problem caused by admins going into the database and
modifying these values?

Engelbert

"Mike McIntyre [MSFT]" <mmcintyr@online.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:6c3b040868ef8c7b269f6da1135@msnews.microsoft.com...
Quote:
Hello Engelbert,
The underlying value refers to the value stored in the Lists table. When
we add a value into a list item, we look up the corresponding entry in the
Lists table. We pass in, among other things, the GUID for the Web
(tp_WebId) and the List (tp_ID). We grab the value for tp_NextAvailableId
(underlying value). We increment this and return it back up the chain.
This is the value that will be assigned to the list item. There are other
types of "list items" in WSS. One in particular is the event list item.
Apparently, whenever you modify an event item, it clones the item &
generates a new itemiD. So, if I have event items #1, #2, #3, #4. One
would assume that the next vaue is #5. If I modify the contents of #1, for
instance I edit the description field, the next available itemID value
would be #6, not #5. This is not terribly obvious and has been causing
"mild discomfort" for quite a few users.

I may have mispoke regarding the re-use value (not enough caffeine in my
system). We do not appear to re-use the values. What I meant to say is
that, by default, we appear to generate ItemID values sequentially.
However, depending upon the list type, event items being the best example,
this behavior is not "obvious". The ItemID values should increase but are
not guaranteed to be strictly sequential.

We have seen instances where "well meaning" users will modify the values
in these tables (for reasons unknown) and havoc ensues. Programmatic
access via the OM will work properly. Other programmatic access, T-SQL
statements via query analyzer, can cause big problems.

I hope that clears things up a bit. I've had another Mountain Dew this
morning; so, my eyes, and brain hopefully, are starting to kick in.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.

E> Well you know best, but I'm not sure I follow the logic.
E
The ramifications of this being that if that underlying value is
changed, either programatically or otherwise, you could end up
re-using an itemID.

E> a) what's the "underlying value"
E> E> this
E
Whenever a list item is added to a document library, a stored
procedure is called that queries one of the tables in the database.
This query returns the next available itemID value. That value is
then incremented, and returned back.

E> Seems to indicate 1,2,3,4,5,6 etc. because the next available will
E> always surely be the next number in order. No ?
E> E> Or is it that if you delete a document then it's ID number becomes
E> available for re-use. This seems unlikely because then you'd need to
E> retain *all* previously deleted numbers and the largest ID number so
E> far rather than having a single field containing the next number.
E> E> b) "either programatically or otherwise"
E> E> are you saying that the code written by Microsoft and which is in
WSS
E> as delivered could do this ("otherwise"), or are you saying that if
E> some user/administrator writes *their own* code ("programmatically"),
E> they could mess this up ?
E> E> Surely then it would be their fault if the ID field didn't work as
it
E> should ?
E> E> Engelbert
E> E> "Mike McIntyre [MSFT]" <mmcintyr@online.microsoft.com> wrote in
E> message news:6c3b040867438c7b1b3dd6f6487@msnews.microsoft.com...
E
Hello Engelbert,
Well, it's not strictly autonumber. Whenever a list item is added to
a
document library, a stored procedure is called that queries one of
the
tables in the database. This query returns the next available itemID
value. That value is then incremented, and returned back. So, while
the
itemID looks to be autonumber; in actuality, it is not. The
ramifications
of this being that if that underlying value is changed, either
programatically or otherwise, you could end up re-using an itemID.
We've
seen it happen before.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.

E> You can use the standard ID field. It's an autonumber.
E> E> Just select it in your specification of the View. It's listed
E> already.
E> E> Engelbert
E> E> "amos hchmon" <amoshchmon@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message
E> news:19AA19AB-D0CA-43DB-894E-D1832B022422@microsoft.com...
E
I want to add an "auto number" column to my list in the team site.
Did its possible ? because do not exist attribute in the "add
list". If did, how do it.

thanks for who refer my question.


Back to top
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]
Guest





Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 5:51 pm    Post subject: Re: add a "auto number" culomn in the list. Reply with quote

Hello Engelbert,
The underlying value refers to the value stored in the Lists table. When
we add a value into a list item, we look up the corresponding entry in the
Lists table. We pass in, among other things, the GUID for the Web (tp_WebId)
and the List (tp_ID). We grab the value for tp_NextAvailableId (underlying
value). We increment this and return it back up the chain. This is the value
that will be assigned to the list item. There are other types of "list items"
in WSS. One in particular is the event list item. Apparently, whenever you
modify an event item, it clones the item & generates a new itemiD. So, if
I have event items #1, #2, #3, #4. One would assume that the next vaue is
#5. If I modify the contents of #1, for instance I edit the description field,
the next available itemID value would be #6, not #5. This is not terribly
obvious and has been causing "mild discomfort" for quite a few users.

I may have mispoke regarding the re-use value (not enough caffeine in my
system). We do not appear to re-use the values. What I meant to say is that,
by default, we appear to generate ItemID values sequentially. However, depending
upon the list type, event items being the best example, this behavior is
not "obvious". The ItemID values should increase but are not guaranteed to
be strictly sequential.

We have seen instances where "well meaning" users will modify the values
in these tables (for reasons unknown) and havoc ensues. Programmatic access
via the OM will work properly. Other programmatic access, T-SQL statements
via query analyzer, can cause big problems.

I hope that clears things up a bit. I've had another Mountain Dew this morning;
so, my eyes, and brain hopefully, are starting to kick in.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.

E> Well you know best, but I'm not sure I follow the logic.
E>
Quote:
The ramifications of this being that if that underlying value is
changed, either programatically or otherwise, you could end up
re-using an itemID.

E> a) what's the "underlying value"

E>
E> this
E>
Quote:
Whenever a list item is added to a document library, a stored
procedure is called that queries one of the tables in the database.
This query returns the next available itemID value. That value is
then incremented, and returned back.

E> Seems to indicate 1,2,3,4,5,6 etc. because the next available will

E> always surely be the next number in order. No ?
E>
E> Or is it that if you delete a document then it's ID number becomes
E> available for re-use. This seems unlikely because then you'd need to
E> retain *all* previously deleted numbers and the largest ID number so
E> far rather than having a single field containing the next number.
E>
E> b) "either programatically or otherwise"
E>
E> are you saying that the code written by Microsoft and which is in WSS
E> as delivered could do this ("otherwise"), or are you saying that if
E> some user/administrator writes *their own* code ("programmatically"),
E> they could mess this up ?
E>
E> Surely then it would be their fault if the ID field didn't work as it
E> should ?
E>
E> Engelbert
E>
E> "Mike McIntyre [MSFT]" <mmcintyr@online.microsoft.com> wrote in
E> message news:6c3b040867438c7b1b3dd6f6487@msnews.microsoft.com...
E>
Quote:
Hello Engelbert,
Well, it's not strictly autonumber. Whenever a list item is added to
a
document library, a stored procedure is called that queries one of
the
tables in the database. This query returns the next available itemID
value. That value is then incremented, and returned back. So, while
the
itemID looks to be autonumber; in actuality, it is not. The
ramifications
of this being that if that underlying value is changed, either
programatically or otherwise, you could end up re-using an itemID.
We've
seen it happen before.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.

E> You can use the standard ID field. It's an autonumber.
E> E> Just select it in your specification of the View. It's listed
E> already.
E> E> Engelbert
E> E> "amos hchmon" <amoshchmon@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message
E> news:19AA19AB-D0CA-43DB-894E-D1832B022422@microsoft.com...
E
I want to add an "auto number" column to my list in the team site.
Did its possible ? because do not exist attribute in the "add
list". If did, how do it.

thanks for who refer my question.
Back to top
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]
Guest





Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 9:51 pm    Post subject: Re: add a "auto number" culomn in the list. Reply with quote

Hello Engelbert,
Yes & no :-) It depends upon the list type. For example, if you create just
a normal, custom list. You can modify the default view to include the ID
so that you can see what's going on. If you add a couple of fields (type
doesn't really matter). If you add #1, #2, #3, etc. Now, go back and edit
#1. The next ID will be #4. Now, if you create an event item, the same does
not apply. If you add #1, #2, and #3. Now, go back and modify #1 (edit the
comment field). The next itemID will be 5, not 4. This has to do with the
underlying implementation of the code.

Does it make sense? Not to me :-)
Is it by design? You bet!
Is it intuitive? No way!

I believe, but have not verified, that calendar items may "enjoy this behavior".
It should be easy enough to repro.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.

E> Thanks for spending the time to go through this.
E>
E> Just the final nail in this.
E>
E> Using your example, if the description field of #1 is edited *using
E> the normal WSS UI* then what you wrote applies ?
E>
E> I.e. it's not only a problem caused by admins going into the database
E> and modifying these values?
E>
E> Engelbert
E>
E> "Mike McIntyre [MSFT]" <mmcintyr@online.microsoft.com> wrote in
E> message news:6c3b040868ef8c7b269f6da1135@msnews.microsoft.com...
E>
Quote:
Hello Engelbert,
The underlying value refers to the value stored in the Lists table.
When
we add a value into a list item, we look up the corresponding entry
in the
Lists table. We pass in, among other things, the GUID for the Web
(tp_WebId) and the List (tp_ID). We grab the value for
tp_NextAvailableId
(underlying value). We increment this and return it back up the
chain.
This is the value that will be assigned to the list item. There are
other
types of "list items" in WSS. One in particular is the event list
item.
Apparently, whenever you modify an event item, it clones the item &
generates a new itemiD. So, if I have event items #1, #2, #3, #4. One
would assume that the next vaue is #5. If I modify the contents of
#1, for
instance I edit the description field, the next available itemID
value
would be #6, not #5. This is not terribly obvious and has been
causing
"mild discomfort" for quite a few users.
I may have mispoke regarding the re-use value (not enough caffeine in
my system). We do not appear to re-use the values. What I meant to
say is that, by default, we appear to generate ItemID values
sequentially. However, depending upon the list type, event items
being the best example, this behavior is not "obvious". The ItemID
values should increase but are not guaranteed to be strictly
sequential.

We have seen instances where "well meaning" users will modify the
values in these tables (for reasons unknown) and havoc ensues.
Programmatic access via the OM will work properly. Other programmatic
access, T-SQL statements via query analyzer, can cause big problems.

I hope that clears things up a bit. I've had another Mountain Dew
this morning; so, my eyes, and brain hopefully, are starting to kick
in.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.

E> Well you know best, but I'm not sure I follow the logic. E

The ramifications of this being that if that underlying value is
changed, either programatically or otherwise, you could end up
re-using an itemID.

E> a) what's the "underlying value"
E> E> this
E
Whenever a list item is added to a document library, a stored
procedure is called that queries one of the tables in the database.
This query returns the next available itemID value. That value is
then incremented, and returned back.

E> Seems to indicate 1,2,3,4,5,6 etc. because the next available will
E> always surely be the next number in order. No ?
E> E> Or is it that if you delete a document then it's ID number
becomes
E> available for re-use. This seems unlikely because then you'd need
to
E> retain *all* previously deleted numbers and the largest ID number
so
E> far rather than having a single field containing the next number.
E> E> b) "either programatically or otherwise"
E> E> are you saying that the code written by Microsoft and which is
in
WSS
E> as delivered could do this ("otherwise"), or are you saying that
if
E> some user/administrator writes *their own* code
("programmatically"),
E> they could mess this up ?
E> E> Surely then it would be their fault if the ID field didn't work
as
it
E> should ?
E> E> Engelbert
E> E> "Mike McIntyre [MSFT]" <mmcintyr@online.microsoft.com> wrote in
E> message news:6c3b040867438c7b1b3dd6f6487@msnews.microsoft.com...
E
Hello Engelbert,
Well, it's not strictly autonumber. Whenever a list item is added
to
a
document library, a stored procedure is called that queries one of
the
tables in the database. This query returns the next available
itemID
value. That value is then incremented, and returned back. So, while
the
itemID looks to be autonumber; in actuality, it is not. The
ramifications
of this being that if that underlying value is changed, either
programatically or otherwise, you could end up re-using an itemID.
We've
seen it happen before.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
--
-----------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.
E> You can use the standard ID field. It's an autonumber.
E> E> Just select it in your specification of the View. It's listed
E> already.
E> E> Engelbert
E> E> "amos hchmon" <amoshchmon@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message
E> news:19AA19AB-D0CA-43DB-894E-D1832B022422@microsoft.com...
E
I want to add an "auto number" column to my list in the team
site. Did its possible ? because do not exist attribute in the
"add list". If did, how do it.

thanks for who refer my question.
Back to top
Engelbert
Guest





Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:51 am    Post subject: Re: add a "auto number" culomn in the list. Reply with quote

OK. Thanks, Mike. That's clear enough :)

Engelbert

"Mike McIntyre [MSFT]" <mmcintyr@online.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:6c3b0408699c8c7b2863b82fb35@msnews.microsoft.com...
Quote:
Hello Engelbert,
Yes & no :-) It depends upon the list type. For example, if you create
just a normal, custom list. You can modify the default view to include the
ID so that you can see what's going on. If you add a couple of fields
(type doesn't really matter). If you add #1, #2, #3, etc. Now, go back and
edit #1. The next ID will be #4. Now, if you create an event item, the
same does not apply. If you add #1, #2, and #3. Now, go back and modify #1
(edit the comment field). The next itemID will be 5, not 4. This has to do
with the underlying implementation of the code.

Does it make sense? Not to me :-)
Is it by design? You bet!
Is it intuitive? No way!

I believe, but have not verified, that calendar items may "enjoy this
behavior". It should be easy enough to repro.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.

E> Thanks for spending the time to go through this.
E> E> Just the final nail in this.
E> E> Using your example, if the description field of #1 is edited *using
E> the normal WSS UI* then what you wrote applies ?
E> E> I.e. it's not only a problem caused by admins going into the
database
E> and modifying these values?
E> E> Engelbert
E> E> "Mike McIntyre [MSFT]" <mmcintyr@online.microsoft.com> wrote in
E> message news:6c3b040868ef8c7b269f6da1135@msnews.microsoft.com...
E
Hello Engelbert,
The underlying value refers to the value stored in the Lists table.
When
we add a value into a list item, we look up the corresponding entry
in the
Lists table. We pass in, among other things, the GUID for the Web
(tp_WebId) and the List (tp_ID). We grab the value for
tp_NextAvailableId
(underlying value). We increment this and return it back up the
chain.
This is the value that will be assigned to the list item. There are
other
types of "list items" in WSS. One in particular is the event list
item.
Apparently, whenever you modify an event item, it clones the item &
generates a new itemiD. So, if I have event items #1, #2, #3, #4. One
would assume that the next vaue is #5. If I modify the contents of
#1, for
instance I edit the description field, the next available itemID
value
would be #6, not #5. This is not terribly obvious and has been
causing
"mild discomfort" for quite a few users.
I may have mispoke regarding the re-use value (not enough caffeine in
my system). We do not appear to re-use the values. What I meant to
say is that, by default, we appear to generate ItemID values
sequentially. However, depending upon the list type, event items
being the best example, this behavior is not "obvious". The ItemID
values should increase but are not guaranteed to be strictly
sequential.

We have seen instances where "well meaning" users will modify the
values in these tables (for reasons unknown) and havoc ensues.
Programmatic access via the OM will work properly. Other programmatic
access, T-SQL statements via query analyzer, can cause big problems.

I hope that clears things up a bit. I've had another Mountain Dew
this morning; so, my eyes, and brain hopefully, are starting to kick
in.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.

E> Well you know best, but I'm not sure I follow the logic. E

The ramifications of this being that if that underlying value is
changed, either programatically or otherwise, you could end up
re-using an itemID.

E> a) what's the "underlying value"
E> E> this
E
Whenever a list item is added to a document library, a stored
procedure is called that queries one of the tables in the database.
This query returns the next available itemID value. That value is
then incremented, and returned back.

E> Seems to indicate 1,2,3,4,5,6 etc. because the next available will
E> always surely be the next number in order. No ?
E> E> Or is it that if you delete a document then it's ID number
becomes
E> available for re-use. This seems unlikely because then you'd need
to
E> retain *all* previously deleted numbers and the largest ID number
so
E> far rather than having a single field containing the next number.
E> E> b) "either programatically or otherwise"
E> E> are you saying that the code written by Microsoft and which is
in
WSS
E> as delivered could do this ("otherwise"), or are you saying that
if
E> some user/administrator writes *their own* code
("programmatically"),
E> they could mess this up ?
E> E> Surely then it would be their fault if the ID field didn't work
as
it
E> should ?
E> E> Engelbert
E> E> "Mike McIntyre [MSFT]" <mmcintyr@online.microsoft.com> wrote in
E> message news:6c3b040867438c7b1b3dd6f6487@msnews.microsoft.com...
E
Hello Engelbert,
Well, it's not strictly autonumber. Whenever a list item is added
to
a
document library, a stored procedure is called that queries one of
the
tables in the database. This query returns the next available
itemID
value. That value is then incremented, and returned back. So, while
the
itemID looks to be autonumber; in actuality, it is not. The
ramifications
of this being that if that underlying value is changed, either
programatically or otherwise, you could end up re-using an itemID.
We've
seen it happen before.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
--
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Regards,
Mike McIntyre [MSFT]
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.
E> You can use the standard ID field. It's an autonumber.
E> E> Just select it in your specification of the View. It's listed
E> already.
E> E> Engelbert
E> E> "amos hchmon" <amoshchmon@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message
E> news:19AA19AB-D0CA-43DB-894E-D1832B022422@microsoft.com...
E
I want to add an "auto number" column to my list in the team
site. Did its possible ? because do not exist attribute in the
"add list". If did, how do it.

thanks for who refer my question.


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amos hchmon
Guest





Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 9:51 am    Post subject: RE: add a "auto number" culomn in the list. Reply with quote

Mike mcintyre and Engelbert thanks you for the referred to my question.
I am not understood what I need to do.
If I need to do it with attribute that built in the lists on the WSS like
fields (column) hyperlink, number, combobox,checkbox etc .
Or I need to develop this field.
Can you send me example or reference about this?
Again thanks.


"amos hchmon" wrote:

Quote:
I want to add an "auto number" column to my list in the team site.
Did its possible ? because do not exist attribute in the "add list".
If did, how do it.

thanks for who refer my question.
Back to top
 
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